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Omer
#1 Posted : Sunday, February 8, 2009 11:49:31 PM(UTC)
Omer

Rank: Member

Joined: 2/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 100

In Site Settings / Orders - "Merge Identical Cart Items" is checked but actually it does not merge the same items in Cart page which causes major problems with Shipping Rates.

I have personalized items. Lets say a customer adds 5 of the same products to the cart but each has different personalization. The shipping charges are 5 times more than it should be because it does not merge the items when calculating the shipping charges.

What do I do to ix it? It seems like I lost a lot of sales because of that.
Andy Miller
#2 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 1:54:21 AM(UTC)
Andy Miller

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Normally BVC5 will combine all the items in the cart into 1 "box" and then calculate the shipping cost for that box. You can change that behavior by marking the product to ship separately or to ship from the manufacturer/vendor. If the product is marked to ship separately, then BVC5 will calculate the shipping cost for the item separately. And if the product is marked to ship from the manufacturer or vendor, then it is combined with other items from the same manufacturer or vendor into a separate "box" and then the shipping cost is calculated for the box.

If you have not marked the product to ship separately or to ship from the manufacturer or vendor, then it is not being treated separately when shipping costs are calculated.

What shipping methods have you created?
Andy Miller
Structured Solutions

Shipper 3 - High Velocity Shipment Processing
Omer
#3 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 9:55:23 AM(UTC)
Omer

Rank: Member

Joined: 2/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 100

By default if there is no vendor selected, all the items have to be in the same "box" in your terms. For simple reason: if no vendor entered, then all the cart items should be shipped from the store itself, which means all items need to be in one "box" automatically.

Currently each product is calculated separately if no vendor selected. Going back to my original example:
Lets say a customer adds 5 of the same products to the cart but each has different personalization. The shipping charges are 5 times more than it should be because it does not merge the items when calculating the shipping charges.

In this example, no vendor is entered. So BV should automatically assume that all products are being shipped from the website location , they are the same kind of products and all should be combined.

I don't understand why I should select 'ship separately' when they should not be shipped separately.
Matt@9BallDesign
#4 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 11:56:56 AM(UTC)
Matt@9BallDesign

Rank: Member

Joined: 12/23/2003(UTC)
Posts: 909

They're not identical items if you say there are different personalizations for each item within the structure of how BV operates.

I always have merge identical items activated on stores, here's how it works in BV:

Customer buys a Large Red Helmet (0000-0123). Customer buys the same helmet but it's X-Large in the same order:

0000-0123 + 0000-0124 are added as individual line items to the cart even though they technically are the same item.

Customer buys 2 Large Red Helmets

(2) 0000-0123.

Rather than 2 line items, they are merged into 1 line item priced at QTY 2. If the customer bought 1 large red helmet, did some more shopping and then decided to add a second large red helmet, they would merge into 1 line item (QTY 2) in the shopping cart.

In your situation, it seems that the items are not identical so they are not merged and subsequently receiving individual shipping charges per item.
Matt Martell


http://www.9balldesign.com - Web, Print, Graphic


http://www.martellhardware.com/ - Decorative & Builder's Hardware

------------------------------------------------
Omer
#5 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 12:26:18 PM(UTC)
Omer

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Joined: 2/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 100

Live example

http://www.nicegesture.c...ilver-bottle-opener.aspx

step 1 > Personalize it for your friend X - add 1 to cart - calculate shipping - $5

step 2 > Go back to the same item - Personalize it for your other friend Y - add 1 to cart - then shipping - $10

Merge Identical Items is checked and Ship Separately not checked.

This is not correct.


Try this:
Personalize and add 2 to cart - calculate shipping - $5.12 This is the correct charge for 2 of them. not $10.

What do we do to fix this?
Aaron
#6 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 12:50:08 PM(UTC)
Aaron

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Omer,

It does look like a bug. I added two of the same item to my cart, with different options, and the shipping cost was almost double than if I added one item to my cart and changed the quantity to 2. I would submit this to BV as a bug. Granted, I guess we should probably test this on a few other stores to see if it's a problem across the board.
Aaron Sherrick
BV Commerce
Toll-free 888-665-8637 - Int'l +1 717-220-0012
Matt@9BallDesign
#7 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 12:58:31 PM(UTC)
Matt@9BallDesign

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Joined: 12/23/2003(UTC)
Posts: 909

Just did the example.


GC195 is added to the cart twice, but the personalization is not the same, therefore they are not identical items and will not be merged. 2 line items, Shipping calculated seperately. I get shipping of $19.



(2) GC195 is added with one personalization, identical items are merged, shipping calculated at $10.



Shipping is whacky here, but I'm only trying to explain what qualifies as an indentical item. Even though it's GC195 in all instances, the personalization (a.ka. Modifier or Choice) is making the item a unique item.
Matt Martell


http://www.9balldesign.com - Web, Print, Graphic


http://www.martellhardware.com/ - Decorative & Builder's Hardware

------------------------------------------------
MitchA
#8 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 1:18:00 PM(UTC)
MitchA

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Posts: 1,737

It's not a bug, they are different - they need to be different so you can have a "Buy 2 and get one free" offer.

One large shirt and one X-large shirt. Not the same product because they don't 'merge', no free offer compliance.

OR - One Large shirt and then another large shirt. They merge and you get the 3rd for free.

ALSO:
Some of us have 'options' that make a product double in weight and girth. I don't want dissimilar products to merge even though they are based on the same basic product. Separate shipping is a must sometimes, sometimes not.


Sucks, but it's correct as-is.
.
Optimists invent airplanes,
Pessimists buy parachutes.
MitchA
#9 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 1:43:37 PM(UTC)
MitchA

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Joined: 3/3/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,737

Omer,

The way around this is to have a bunch of 'choices' for text:

Text: _____________
Text: _____________
Text: _____________

....add the number of choices you'll likely need to the product.



If they need 3 items, they'll merge and you will then have a 1 item invoice showing 3 pieces and 3 lines of text to match - simple to read at the office.

...Might be easier on the shopper than going back to the product page over and over too. Set up a shared choice for this.
Optimists invent airplanes,
Pessimists buy parachutes.
Omer
#10 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 2:00:28 PM(UTC)
Omer

Rank: Member

Joined: 2/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 100

Mitch,

I disagree. Your approach is wrong. If 2 of the same items are being shipped together from point A to point B in one box, then the shipping charge will be much less compared to they are being shipped separately.

Here is an example:
Product: X
Weight: 10lbs.

Customer adds 1 to cart. Shipping charge $15

Customer continues shopping. Goes back to the same product. Customer adds another X to the cart with an additional option to it. So now the product is 15lbs.

Total Shipping Charge BV shows is around $40 while it is actually between $25 - $30. The shipping will be cheaper if the package combines both items under one shipment package.

In your example about products with options that make double in weight and girth is like my example above. So this is not configured correctly in BV and this has nothing to do with any offer like Buy 2 Get 1 Free. A wrong logic is applied to the shipping module and this needs to be corrected. I probably lost tons of sales because of this. 10 bottle opener costs $90 to ship?? you can't possibly make me believe BV is correct.
Matt@9BallDesign
#11 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 2:17:48 PM(UTC)
Matt@9BallDesign

Rank: Member

Joined: 12/23/2003(UTC)
Posts: 909

Hey Omer, take a peek at Andy Miller's shipping solutions, drastically expands on your options with how your items are set up:

http://structured-solutions.net/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=RULEPROV-BV5
Matt Martell


http://www.9balldesign.com - Web, Print, Graphic


http://www.martellhardware.com/ - Decorative & Builder's Hardware

------------------------------------------------
Omer
#12 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 2:26:28 PM(UTC)
Omer

Rank: Member

Joined: 2/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 100

Mitch,

Thanks for the work around but this needs to be fixed in BV. We are giving wrong shipping charges to customers. Regardless of any option added for a product, all the items in cart needs to be calculated under 1 package unless a different manufacturer or vendor is selected.
Aaron
#13 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 3:27:29 PM(UTC)
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Omer, I'm with you. The "merge identical cart items" is really irrelevant to the shipping discussion. Regardless of if the items are identical, unless the "ship separately" checkbox is checked for one of these two products, they should be shipping in the same box.
Aaron Sherrick
BV Commerce
Toll-free 888-665-8637 - Int'l +1 717-220-0012
MitchA
#14 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 3:32:28 PM(UTC)
MitchA

Rank: Member

Joined: 3/3/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,737

Omer,

This has been discussed at length here for years in many threads. Bottom line... Different choices often create different products that shouldn't or can't be combined - or even shipped from the same place because of the choice selected.

The BVC guys don't run a store and can't possibly know how deficient it is.

I agree, 19 tubes of mint toothpaste and 1 tube of garlic toothpaste should all ship in the same box, but won't merge.

Having said that, there is a solution, but we're not likely to ever see it. We need to be able to 'merge' like items, regardless of product heritage, just like you're asking for.

One of the reasons this will not be done... it's a whole new database entry (product type by size and weight and 'merge-ability') and none of us are Amazon and we can't all pay for Amazon's store. And hey, even Amazon's getting it wrong sometimes. Last week, I got a $28.00 rebate on shipping after a human looked at the order.
.
Optimists invent airplanes,
Pessimists buy parachutes.
MitchA
#15 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 3:36:00 PM(UTC)
MitchA

Rank: Member

Joined: 3/3/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,737

Omer, quick test for you... (a flash of inspiration)

Are you setting up 'choices' or 'modifiers'?

Choices make new SKU's, modifiers don't affect the SKU. If you don't care about the SKU changing, perhaps you could try making a product with modifiers and see if they'll merge because they'll have the same SKU.

I use only modifiers on my site.
Optimists invent airplanes,
Pessimists buy parachutes.
Aaron
#16 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 3:38:12 PM(UTC)
Aaron

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Mitch,

I'm not sure that I'm following you. It sounds like you're saying that every line item in your cart will have its shipping calculated as a separate package.
Aaron Sherrick
BV Commerce
Toll-free 888-665-8637 - Int'l +1 717-220-0012
Andy Miller
#17 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 3:50:23 PM(UTC)
Andy Miller

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I agree with Aaron. "Merge Identical Items" should have no affect on shipping cost calculations. The shipping cost for 2 separate personalized items should be the same as shipping quantity 2 of 1 personalized item.

For example, the shipping cost for these 2 orders should be the same:

Order 1
2 x Shirt with monogram ABC

Order 2
1 x Shirt with monogram ABC
1 x Shirt with monogram DEF

What I'm reading is that the shipping cost for order #2 is twice as much as the shipping cost for order #1. Sounds like a bug.

My Shipping Rate Rule Providers would solve the problem because they create their own "boxes" and would put both items in one box. But that seems like using a sledgehammer to drive in a nail. I think it would be better to solve the problem first.
Andy Miller
Structured Solutions

Shipper 3 - High Velocity Shipment Processing
MitchA
#18 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 3:57:08 PM(UTC)
MitchA

Rank: Member

Joined: 3/3/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,737

Originally Posted by: "Aaron" Go to Quoted Post
Mitch,

I'm not sure that I'm following you. It sounds like you're saying that every line item in your cart will have its shipping calculated as a separate package.


Simple:

A product "Lamp Shades" has a choice offering "Small" and "Large" and is NOT checked "ship separately" meaning we want them to ship in the same box....

2 SMALL lampshades shipping from the store DO fit into a box and CAN be shipped together so they will merge and are not checked "ship separately", so they WILL ship together.

2 LARGE lampshades shipping from the store WON'T physically fit into the same box and CAN'T be shipped together but they will still merge and are still not checked "ship separately", but they CAN'T ship together.

Making a product with a "small/large" choice in this case makes a different shipping parameter that BVC doesn't handle. There are plenty of others examples over the years where it just won't do it right.....


How do you get the shipping right?

The solution is: make a product "Small Shades" and another product "Large Shades". Small shades ship together, large shades don't.
Optimists invent airplanes,
Pessimists buy parachutes.
MitchA
#19 Posted : Monday, February 9, 2009 4:45:14 PM(UTC)
MitchA

Rank: Member

Joined: 3/3/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1,737

Originally Posted by: "Andy Miller" Go to Quoted Post
I agree with Aaron. "Merge Identical Items" should have no affect on shipping cost calculations. The shipping cost for 2 separate personalized items should be the same as shipping quantity 2 of 1 personalized item.

For example, the shipping cost for these 2 orders should be the same:

Order 1
2 x Shirt with monogram ABC

Order 2
1 x Shirt with monogram ABC
1 x Shirt with monogram DEF

What I'm reading is that the shipping cost for order #2 is twice as much as the shipping cost for order #1. Sounds like a bug.



Andy, it's not a bug, it's working as intended but is poorly designed. I'd like to see this improved and had a few very long conversations with Nick and Justin a long time ago on this.
Optimists invent airplanes,
Pessimists buy parachutes.
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